(If you don’t read this entire post, please at least see my update, below.)
I thought I’d blog about this, because I had a call regarding it on Friday.
He started normally enough, by telling me he had found me on a job search site, then started asking about my experience/qualifications. I asked if he wanted me to email them my up-to-date CV. He declined, saying “you can do it after the call if you like”.
I had an appointment and they had neglected to ask the usual “is it OK to talk right now?” so I was trying to get rid of them from the off, while not really taking it all in at normal speed. That said, I didn’t want to be rude to a potential new agency who might find me work, so I persisted.
Apparently they’ve been tasked with finding staff, but they must be MCITP-certified, and they can’t find anyone with this qualification. (I’d never heard of it, but it is a legitimate Microsoft qualification.)
To get around this problem, they’re willing to invest the time in training people to get them through the MCITP exams. Takes 3-4 months apparently. Alarm bells went off a bit for me here. Why would they bother training anyone? If you can home-study this exam in 3 months, how important can it really be? What recruitment agency would pay for this?
The training investment is to the tune of £4.5k. Even more ridiculous. But they’ll only accept people who pass their telephone interview. In a rush to get rid of him, I accepted this telephone interview for 3pm on Monday.
Apparently they both “try” and get you a job during the training, which will also be “22k minimum”. How can a theoretical job be at a salary of £22k minimum?
And you don’t have to pay for this training, but there’s a small admin charge of £79 per month. That’s a pretty fucking big admin charge, isn’t it? Again, I was trying to get him off the phone, so made the right noises, just to end the call as quick as possible. He said he’d email me confirmation of my interview time.
Thinking all this smells a bit of those training schools for becoming a driving instructor, which near-guarantee you a high salary upon completing your exams, I did a bit of research.
It’s not a great start when you Google the name of a company and get back results like “too much like Careerjobs UK?” with people asking if it is a scam, is it?
Especially not when it links to sites like this about CareerJobs UK, which use the word “scam” a lot, and feature people who have been promised lower amounts on the phone, then had differing “admin fees” taken from their bank account. Apparently they target the unemployed on job websites, and everyone passes their telephone interview to pass to the training/paying level.
Also from what I’ve been able to piece together online, I think they’re the same people who place adverts on Jobsite with titles like:
“IT Engineer **No Experience Needed** / Support / Network”
…that I’ve been ignoring for months. Replace “IT Engineer” with various other IT jobs if you like. They do loads of them, although IT engineer and database-related ones seem the most common.
Far from taking 3-4 months, the people on those forum threads estimate that the MCITP course takes a year, but can apparently be completed in 7-8 months at a push. A year at £79 per month is £948.
And even after that, a search on Jobsite for “MCITP” jobs in Bristol finds me three jobs that want people with the qualification. All three say you must have 3-5 years commercial experience at that level.
JobSource UK confirmed the interview time as follows:
“Hi Ben,
Thank you for our telephone conversation today. Please view all details of how we can help you gain entry into the lucrative world of IT.
As discussed during our conversation I would like to confirm that you have been selected to attend an on- line interview at:
15:00 hrs on Monday the 12th of September 2011
You will need to be by an internet enabled computer to have access to all the relevant information. Our aim, should you be successful and accepted onto the programme, is to assist placing you into employment in an IT capacity e.g IT network engineer. Starting salary can vary significantly depending on age, experience, qualifications, company placement and geographical area.
Should you be successful for inclusion onto the IT Development Programme, at Job Source UK we aim to make the path to becoming an I.T professional as easy as possible. We’ll advise you on which programme to go for and what extra training to complete – all based on what you want to gain from your future employment. We will organise every aspect of your training and help you to secure a career that suits you.
In the attached files and links is all the information you need to take the first step of your new career.I look forward to speaking to you again on the date and at the time stated above.
Our Web Site – www.jobsourceuk.com
Job Descriptions (see attached file)”
You’ll notice that the salary in writing now “varies substantially depending on age, experience and qualifications”, so is no longer “£22k minimum” like on the phone.
The attached file (he says “files”.. there was only one) is a sketchy 1-page document that starts with the words:
“If you enjoy problem solving and are technically minded, then you are well suited to a career as a Network Engineer.”
…and ends with an over-complex graphic which seems to suggest that network engineers have a start salary of £28,000, while at the same time stating above it that:
“There is currently a shortage of network engineers with typical pay/benefit packages of £28-£55,000. As a new entrant without IT experience you can expect a starting salary of £18-£27,000.”
…so it’s dropped to £18,000 now. Which is possibly still slightly optimistic, for someone with absolutely no IT experience.
I replied to it and told them I was no longer available at 3pm on Monday, didn’t want to attend and interview, and had no interest in their products. Hopefully that’ll be the end of it.
Update: 20th Septmber 2011, 16:35.
I’ve just been phoned by the guy who originally called/emailed me from Jobsource, to ask me to remove his name from this blog post. I have now done this.
He also wished to clarify some points. I made notes while he was talking to me and he told me that:
They want to make it clear they’re not scamming anybody, and it is possible to complete the MCITP exam in 3-4 months if you already have other Microsoft qualifications or the A+. Without them, it might take around 8 months.
They also clarified that they cannot and do not promise anyone guaranteed work.
They never say that most employers insist on MCITP-certification, but the ones they work with, do.
It is not the same organisation as CareerJobs. Somebody who used to work as an employee at CareerJobs left the company, and is now one of the bosses of JobSource. JobSource offers much better support to learners than CareerJobs.
With regards users being stuck in contracts, he told me that:
Any user can cancel within 7 days, but must do so in writing. This is set out in the terms and conditions of JobSource, which is emailed to those who pass the interview, within 30 minutes of being informed they are successful and them being signed up.
In effect, they are selling IT training, but do work with employers and have a 93% success rate of finding people work. They do not guarantee you a job. Neither they, nor anyone else, can.
I didn’t think my original blog post was that controversial really. I’ve just checked and I haven’t called it a scam, anywhere. Just a statement of things as I saw them, and what I found while looking for more information. I’m a naturally skeptical sod, and so when a company I don’t know calls me, I do my research. And that happens, whether it’s a recruitment company, a training company, or an employer inviting me to an interview.
I still think that the bigger problem JobSource has (bigger than an occasionally-grumpy blogger from Bristol) is that anyone who does a Google search will find the same Certforums and Techexams forum posts that I did. And while some of those posts complain about unimportant things like JobSource’s website layout (which I think is fine), there’s a lot of people comparing JobSource with CareerJobs, and CareerJobs doesn’t seem to have had the greatest reputation. Even some of them posting complete emails sent by CareerJobs, which appear to match word-for-word, the one that I received from JobSource confirming my interview invitation. I think if you’re using another company’s templates, while trying to distance yourself from them, you’re going to struggle.
I had exactly the same phone call from the same bloke today. It’s clearly an absolute scam.
The thing is that I don’t doubt that they’re selling legitimate training. It’s just the way it’s dressed up to include an additional (fictional) job, at an ever-changing “minimum” salary.
I’d have a lot more respect for them if they just sold the training scheme for £79 per month, and dispensed with all the other bullshit.
MCITP is a real qualification, would likely increase your (mine, everyone’s) chances of finding work, and if I realised I’d be out of work this long, I might have actually started it when I first became unemployed again. I couldn’t afford the £79 per month now.
I had exactly the same call tonight. I accepted a time for an interview for tomorrow but even at that time I thought something wasn’t right.
Like you’ve stated above there seems to be plenty other people getting the same call. And I also thought right away that they’re the same people that post those adverts everywhere – which I’ve also been ignoring. They are just preying on the easy targets of honest people trying to get a new/better job.
Thanks for starting thus blog. I just had the same call a lady stating they were willing to train me over 6months in this mcitp quali for just 8hours a week in my own time at home. Anyhow the call was disconnected or lost signal while she was talking, an I couldn’t call her number back as it was busy constantly
Must be the day for it, I just had one as well
Fired a mail back asking them not to bother me – its abvious they put it down as a legitimate looking job on one of the boards this time or I wouldnt have applied had it been one of the fore mentioned “no skills required” ads.
I think they have access to search CVs uploaded to Jobsite/Monster, like the other recruitment agencies. You might not have applied for anything at all.
They just rang again despite already having called me once. I’ve already done the training for MCITP but I just having taken the exam yet. The guy said that I still needed to do their training to pass it. They are a thoroughly unprofessional company and kept getting my name wrong. During the first call the guy literall said “would you rather do our training or sit at home doing sweet fuck all”. I don’t think a legitimate company would swear at somebody down the phone. I would advise everyone to steer well clear. They are trying to take of advantage of vulnerable people buy pretending that paying them X amount of money will get them a job.
I was dumb enough to accept an interview with careerjobsuk today, even more stupid giving them my bank details thinking the job must be legit after seeing their website and speaking to a professional sounding lady for about an hour.
Followed my gut feeling and phoned my bank after to check and sure enough £79 was taking straight out. I was mislead when the lady talked about fees and got the impression nothing would be taken out till i’d recieved the paperwork and info. However after I phoned to cancel this course they weren’t as quick to refund my money. Fingers crossed they will refund me when they say next week but i wont hold my breath.
I’m not sure of the timescale involved, but I’ve been led to believe there’s a cancellation policy where they refund you, so long as you do it quickly and in the right manner (think it has to be in writing).
I would try and get whatever you’ve told them, in writing. And likewise, I’d want confirmation they will be refunding you. Verbal agreements aren’t worth much.
I’m afraid I can’t advise you more than that, but good luck.
Well I received yesterday the same call phone, the same questions,the same answers and the offer to take the same “free” training…
This time a man told me ” we want to cost your training…but you MUST pass tomorrow an on-line interview with our IT manager and you MUST try to convence him that you won`t left the course in the middle. You MUST show to him your enthusiasm about to get the training” (wtf???)
Thanks for this blog mate!
Had the same phone call in the 26th. Actually managed to get all the way through the ‘interview’ (which it seems is one question: “can you do the course”), not very thorough considering they could only offer 40 places (allegedly)… *** ******* (from JobSource) prattled on about how amazing the course is, how crap my salary is, I could be (with their help, of course) earning £30+k and then very neatly slipped in they need £19 p/w for ‘support’ and he would take a deposit of £19 to ‘secure my place’. I then found out it was £79 taken out before I’d received ANY confirmation of ANYTHING! The website doesn’t work, its registered to some guy in a flat called ******* ***** (who is on the records of careersjobsuk). I have since written and emailed to cancel (am within the 7 day ‘cooling off period) which the Distance Selling Act 2000 allows me to do, but am not sure if I’ll get a refund.
I was totally mislead, misinformed and basically scammed!
Thanks for your comment Mark.
To save myself getting any more phone calls from Jobsource asking me to do so, I’ve gone ahead and removed the names from your comment. Good luck with your refund.
No problem Ben, still no refund, nearly a week after requesting it. The letter i sent hasn’t been signed for at the registered address no has my email been replied to. I have rang a number of times without getting through. It’s not looking good!
Mark
Hi Ben and ALL
I have received a call today about this and also got the same email!
Thanks for posting this as they seem to be going around scaming people who are looking for work, or looking for training and ripping them off.
I will be passing this around blog around to everyone! It is very dishearting to have phones calls like this!
Thanks for posting this Ben 🙂
received call on 5th with same email, guy chased up and all he wanted was my card details.
they are not to be trusted their, website don’t even work, looks dodgy, try clicking links
Was out last week and received two calls from them (two different people with different numbers well apart in the number range). I returned one of the calls, the number was busy a lot of the time and when I got through the person was was not available. He returned my call quickly and went into his sales patter. As with most of these sales calls the thing sounds convincing at the begining but then when you apply some thought its just sales patter. They quoted £19 per week again and arranged a telephone interview. I was going to do the interview and play down my ability and see if I could pass but having read this page I think I will just not bother. Thanks all for the information and comments.
Why do you think this is not legit tho? there was also rumours like this for another company called FDM and i actually went to a interview and assessment day with FDM and i don’t see anything wrong with it, i think this is a really good way to hit into the IT industry.
Everybody on here is very quick to belittle this company because of mainly the sales patter trying to get you on board but I am wondering, has anybody actually been on or are on this course as they have nearly 200 training right now and their opinions are more important before anybody starts criticising them? I have just spoken to them (mgr) and asked them numerous questions which have been questioned here and by myself and his answers all sounded convincing and legitimate. I am not doing this course for other reasons but would have if my current circumstances were not different.
If there is anybody on the course or has been on the course can you please let us know how you are getting on with it, what level of support are you/have been getting, and overall feelings regarding this course.
Yea, I had a call recently and while I was fully on board with the whole development and training program (why not, IT is a growing business, people need to gain a footing in it), I did get slightly dubious when the caller said “We pay for the fees out of our own back”, then moved onto the Admin charge and payments ect, I was like “well why was I informed this before in an email or on the previous call?”.
I still went on with the interview optimistic and as soon as he wanted my card details, I asked for some official/written down email or paperwork which goes over all the information/costs said and all the details in regards to the training, the payments, and why the charge is there. Of course he tried to say nothing was out of place and it’s worth it, and I do believe him and not intending to discredit anything he said. But unless I called or am talking to my bank, I will not give my card details over the phone without reasonable premise.
I think if they did this more professionally, or at least met you face to face, and provided paperwork/emails covering the entire Training scheme/payment/costs up front without the pitch, then they wouldn’t get this threads claiming to be “cons” or extremely shady businessmen.
I am currently doing the job source uk course. i got the same call as everyone else, done the interview, and passed. and immediatly took 79 out of my account. I am and have always been a bit worried that it may be a scam. i am now at the stage of the first exam, and its costing me £99 for 1 exam, and there are 4 more to go, plus 79 per month. Its just abit much for someone who is looking for work.
i did talk about cancelling, but i dont know how to go about it, as they said they will send a debt collector to my door if payments were not met. Please can someone advise me> is it real? is it worth the money and time and if not can i get out of it?
regards
lala
Hi Leanne/Lala,
I had rather assumed that the £79 per month would include the cost of the exams. If not, that’s nearly another £500 added on top of the £79 per month original cost. I’m afraid lots of training companies keep their pricing hidden until you phone them, so I don’t know how that stacks up against the competition.
Good luck with your attempts at cancellation, or failing that, good luck with your exam. It is a real Microsoft qualification that will look good on your CV.
I had a same call today. They sent me the study material as well as the Network Engineer position. In the study plan there was the Microsoft staff for MCIPT. He was pushing me about the Network Engineer training with this MCIPT even I am a Cisco Network Engineer with CCNP level and good Wireless background. With Microsoft (Linux/Unix) and Cisco experience an engineer is called System Engineer as I know. Correct me if I am wrong.
Anyway, I still found this useful, why not, as I have felt reasonable knowledge of Windows servers would be benefical. So went downstairs to talk to my wife about it. She is the man in my family if we are talking about any financial staff. She then said there is no way to pay anything like this. Guys, w/o her I would broke.
Then, googlesearch or this company and found this post. Thanks Ben.
No comment after all 🙂
guys, what do u think, worth to pay anything for CVchecker or CVreview?
I was also worried at first with this company’s unprofessional and worrying manner but went along with all their bullshit and started the training … the training is real and all ,i did their courses for two months .. the problem is the courses are very theoretical and without some previous hands on experience it will be very difficult for a person just starting out ..i personally have some experience and it was easy at first but as things got more complex it’s not easy to follow as you don’t get to actually do something practically and to memorize the things is not an easy task … then i told them i want to quit but they just ignored me so i talked to my bank to stop them from taking money out from my account ,so one day i got a phone call from a guy asking me to pay for a year worth of training or i will be sued or something .. this sounded truly mad and said i will never do that and why would i even consider doing that as i did not sign any contract with them ..the guy on the phone kept on going about some terms and conditions that he emailed me and to which i have agreed and the company will take legal action against me which if you think about it is totally absurd ,and if it is true and they can do that it means this country is going down the drain ..based on what ,on something we talked over the phone ? it’s completely out of the ordinary and absurd …or they might try to scare people into paying them money for nothing ,i was not contacted yet by anybody concerning this matter but i have to say this company is quite something ,they are not a scam meaning that they wont flee with your money but i don’t know how to call then either when they try to stick into you and squeeze anything they can from you